Thursday, July 22, 2010

Remember Me Discussion Group

The following excerpts are from Will Fetter's original script.

Diane and Les's House

DIANE
...look at your face... look at
what they did to your eye. You
don't think you have a case?
TYLER
It's just a cut, mom. It's no big
deal.
DIANE
It's not just a cut, Tyler. And it
is a big deal. You should sue their
pants off. Les, don't you think he
has a case?
LES
(hardly moving his lips)
Well--
CAROLINE
No talking. You're a statue.
Les goes perfectly rigid again.
TYLER
All I want are the charges gone.
Dad's lawyer's taking care of it.
DIANE
I still think you're entitled to
something else... at the very least
an apology from those brutes.
TYLER
It was a brute. Singular. And I
don't think a Municipal Judge can
issue a court order for an apology.
DIANE
Well someone should.

Beach house

ALLY
Thanks for inviting me... I’m
having a really great time.
DIANE
You’re always welcome. And while
we’re on the subject, thank you.
ALLY
For what?
Diane looks through the window at Tyler laughing, smiling.
DIANE
I haven’t seen that smile for some
time now... I was beginning to
worry I’d never see it again.
ALLY
I don't how much it has to do with
me...
DIANE
Modesty is an excellent quality,
honey. Don’t lose that.
Ally hides an embarrassed smile.
ALLY
So do you do this every year?
DIANE
We try. Caroline loves it. Even if
Tyler or Les can’t make it, at the
very least, we'll do a girls
weekend. She needs it, or I need
it, I’m not really sure anymore...
ALLY
That's sweet.
DIANE
I figure I should enjoy her company
now before she hits her teens and
starts hating me for forbidding
college boys and tattoos...
Ally laughs.
DIANE
Can I ask you a question? How's
your relationship with your mother?
Do you still spend time together?
Because I really worry that once
Care gets older she’ll...
Diane trails off as she notices Ally’s expression. Diane
realizing she’s made a dreadful assumption.
DIANE
Oh sweetheart...
ALLY
It’s OK. Really. It's fine.
Ally looks like she could cry. She's embarrassed.
ALLY
I’m sorry. God, you'd think I’d be
over it by now. It's been years.
DIANE
No. I don’t. You never get over it.
You accept it. You persevere. But
you shouldn’t ever get over it...
Diane's voice cracks. She struggles to maintain composure.
DIANE
If that hole in your heart ever
gets filled... How else are you
supposed to remember?



Using these two scenes as a backstory, events that happened, but we did not see in the film, does it change your opinion of Diane?


Script
Memoirs copyright
by Will Fetters

19 comments:

LTavares2010 said...

In my opinion these scenes don`t make lack in the film. Allen Coulter trusted in the talent of Lena Olin. She expresses in her stare and gestures, all the feelings of her character and Coulter prefered to maintain the focus in some relationships: Tyler with his father, Tyler with Caroline, Tyler with Aidan and Tyler with Ally. I think it was a good choice.
Reading these excerpts of the original script don`t change what I feel about Diane. She is a good mother, sympathic, but there are things that she doesn`t seem to perceive or avoid to perceive in Tyler and even in Caroline, and it is there that lies the weakness of Diane maybe because she is their mother or maybe because she is like any human being, she sees only what she wants to see.

WhyIstheRumAlwaysGone said...

Kat thank you for posting the original excerpt from the script! I've been too lazy to go over it again, but I do remember you told us Diane was a much prominent figuire in it. Now I'm going to think about it all over again before I post on this. It does change my views though. It's too bad they cut Diane so much.

jessegirl said...

Well, it shows she's a fighter. I can imagine Tyler, again, pulling away as she inspects his face with her hand perhaps. He's growing up and wants to be treated like a man, but, like any Mom, Diane can't help doing her momma bear thing. I'd probably just be sad that he'd reject her loving, if overprotective, concern, because it's obvious he's got the old man on the case. Translate: he'll accept Charles' help but not Diane's. Aw, Tyler. See, I'm already unhappy with a scene which never even happened, which I'm imagining the actors playing in the manner in which the movie has already shown them. But I like that it shows her animation and normal involvement, 'cause any mother would behave similarly.

The scene with Ally shows a bit of how she perceives Tyler, him laughing now, etc. because of Ally, which reads as a bit cliched, but which, I know would have been anything but when acted, because Lena is that good.
But while she can deliver a lot with just a look, many times the viewer might be left to fill in just a bit too much. Words are necessary sometimes. The lines at the end about the hole in your heart and the grief are actually important ones, about 'how're you supposed to remember' and 'you shouldn't get over it'. I think viewers might need that bit of information about grief in general, and who better to deliver it than Diane? It shows me that she realized something utterly necessary after a devastating death like Michael's. I don't know, I think sometimes directors want to leave too much for the audience to fill in. In this case those words at the end, if acted be this marvellous actress, would have seemed genuine, not over-the-top, and would have given the audience some more solid information about how she is handling grief....and, how she'll handle it when Tyler dies!

InstantKarmaGirl said...

Oh my god that breaks my heart.

I am so sorry that got cut. We've discussed before about this being a male-written movie, with a male director, but I'm with Jesse (she mentioned this in the past), I think I could've stood to see more of Diane.

A mother's pain is so heartbreaking and in this moment Diane and Ally are so connected through such a mutal universal, and yet deeply personal, pain that they instantly know who each other is to the core.

And I love the remark about his smile. It proves to everyone that Tyler wasn't just playing Ally.

And there needed to be more Les, js

WhyIstheRumAlwaysGone said...

Jessegirl what more can we add? You've said it all. I can't understand how they've left Diane out so much. Showing her grief and telling us more about her was essential and they cut it out. The gaping hole thing... I agree, that shouldn't have been left out.

InstantKarmaGirl said...

For the sake of time, some thing probably had to be cut and it was the relationship with his mother that suffered, but i could see where it would need to take a backseat to the almost violent relationship he had with his father...

jessegirl said...

I know they always talk about pacing, but just make it a little bit longer. I guess, too, since the other key people in Tyler's life got more screen time...

Anonymous said...

i don`t believe that he repelled his mother because he is now matured, i think he does it because she is misusing him. why didn`t argued she with her ex-husband? no, she used tyler to do it and he know what she was doing, but he couldn`t help himself, he hadn`t the strength to fight against her, he woudn`t hurt her, but in his heart he know`s that she does wrong so he must stand against his selfish mother and against his hard father. but what she did was much worther, because no parents should use there child on this way. look what she did to caroline. the dress, the socks, all the stuff that makes caroline to an outstander. for others she is a lovely mother, who is doing all for her kids, but only if nothing affected her peace. tyler had no chance against her, because she acted so subtle and looked so weary, but i think she is the strongest character in the movie, because she was capable to misuse her child. how strong must be a mother to do such a gross thing? she should protect her childrens and not use them for her pease. she had to be the fighter. not her child.

jessegirl said...

Anonymous, I respectfully disagree.
Yes, Diane 'misuses' Tyler, getting him to intercede. True enough. But I don't think your comments about Caroline and the dress, etc. is correct. I'm not sure I've understood all of what you've said.
But I take issue with the statement: "..she is the strongest character...because she was capable to misuse her child". That would not be a strong character, but a manipulating one, which is a big difference. If she were strong, she wouldn't feel the need for Tyler to help at all. Her grief cripples her and undermines her ability to parent properly but it is obvious that she loves her children fiercely, but feels impotent to help them sometimes. She is a sad figure, but your comments make her seem reprehensible. Her fight is severely damaged by Michael's death. Don't underestimate this huge loss on her psyche. And if you look at the intimidating man her ex is, you can see how much of a tightrope she had to walk to keep the peace between him and his children (sweets shop scene). -As for Charles, his parenting skills have been severely compromised as well. But that's another comment.

Anonymous said...

dear jessygirl, i am sorry for my english,but i am german and i learned this language by myself. but can you imagine that even michael had to suffer by the behaving of his mother? you are right, she loves her children, but in the first line she will comfort herself, she will have a lovely family, but with charles it proves impossible, so the childs had to give up. they always had to give up, to make no stress. michael wants to be a musisan, but he dares not, so he take charles order to work. if diana had helped him to become a strong person, he would have withstand his fathers order. but she didnt, because that would have distroid her lovely family. after the haircut caroline is traumatisiert, but she didnt is in the arms of her mother, what would have be normal. no, she takes comfort by tyler. look at caroline when the school is over and tyler streched his arms to embrace her and she ignored this gestue. even so young as she is, she mistrust this closeness. she is on the same way tyler was. that was the reason he finaly fight against his father, because he realized that the father must be the person to find a way to carolines feelings. you wrote about the scene in the coffeeshop and what i saw was a young man who tried to make his sister worth to hear what she wanted to say. the father was so absent, he didnt even know what he just did. but if you look at diana, she wants tyler to be quiet. she wants to have the nice meeting. she didnt help him, she wants him to give up. dear jessygirl i believe that i am right about it, because that is one of the reason why i love this movie so much. it is month ago that i saw him the last time in the cinema and there is not one day since that i didnt think about tyler and the movie. this is the reason why i try to learn english, because the next week i can get the dvd from england. here in germany i had to wait till september. i know charles and diana so well. they are my parents. my whole life i thought that my mother was the weak person and i had to fight her battles against my strong dad, who is exactly like charles. but after a long time i found out, that he is the weak person and he is hiding behind this strong and agressiv and distance wall. like diana had my mother misused me. i am 40 years old and even now it is hart work to trust, or let someone realy know me, not only the mask i am taking to protect me. my mother is the strong person, because it doesent matter to her, what she did to her two children, as long as it was a peasefull family. as long as my sister and i did what she wants( not argue with him, always doing what he said, be invisible, not to disturb him), she was fine. if we try to start a rebellion, she starts to cry. and she cried not in front of our dad, no she cried in front of us kids and make us sad and ruefully, so the next time we were quiet and did all what he wants. this feeling was there again, the first time i saw the movie. i saw my parents, my sister and myself. please look at the moment, when he promised to bring his father to the gallerie, yes he wents against his mother, but than, this very moment, when he calls aidens name. how agressiv it sounds, till he can put his mask on again for caroline. dear jessygirl, never before i did writing to anything or someone, but this movie is in my mind, i cant put it out. never before i was so impressed by a movie. i am even sitting at the laptop and writing to someone completly unknown and talk about the bitterness of my family.

BellaMarie247 said...

oh my, this is pretty heavy stuff here.
I wish they hadn't cut this from the film. It surely would have given Diane another dimension for me as I thought she was kind of vapid, a "peace at all costs" kind of woman who obviously loved her children but wouldn't allow herself to stand up to her ex-husband. She tried to stop Tyler from doing so in the coffee shop when truly she should have been the one to say something to defend her daughter. But she wanted a "nice family day" and a sweet reminder of Michael, not a fight. And to be fair, she probably knew she couldn't win against Charles. He is just too overpowering, and she is too broken to fight anymore.

The scene with Ally referenced above would have enhanced the movie for me and given insight into Diane's deeper, truer feelings. She has a big hole in her heart that nothing can fill, and it must remain in order to truly honor her son. The fact that she is going to lose her younger son in such a terrible way has always made me feel sick to my stomach.

jessegirl said...

Yes, BellaMarie, 'sick to my stomach'. I know. That's a place I can't go.
But, like you, this scene with Ally, this discussion about grief, 'the hole in her heart nothing can fill, and it must remain in order to truly honor her son', that is exactly important for the audience to know, and to know about Diane.
I lost my 20 year old son, tragically, and I see the marginalization of Diane's role in the film as its only meaningful flaw. This little scene with Ally would have, as you say, enhanced and given insight we need to know. We know a lot about Charles, Neil, Ally, Tyler,and Caroline, but not a key figure in the family, the mother, the only mother present, Diane.

BellaMarie247 said...

So, dear Jesse, we know about loss like this. Twenty Years ago I lost my fiance' just a few months before our wedding. Nothing has ever filled the space he left in my heart, and try as we may, nothing ever will.

But like the Mom in this film, we do go on. We find our way out of the depths of despair and keep their memories alive in our thoughts and in our hearts, because that's all we CAN do. We want them back, we want all the people who died on September 11th back, but we don't get to have that. Instead, we take the knowledge that every day is sacred and to be lived to the fullest. We let our family and friends know we love them, and we know in our hearts we will see our missing loves again in Heaven someday, and in our dreams when we're lucky.

WhyIstheRumAlwaysGone said...

@BellaMarie - I am deeply moved by your comment. I wanted to ask your permission to quote it for a series of posts (called Sharing Thoughts about RM) which I do on my own blog about RM (I'm one of the sister sites of this blog, and @jessegirl is a guest blogger there as she is here). Please let me know if it's Ok...

BellaMarie247 said...

Rum...it would be an honor for me if you would do that.
Thank you so very much. Yes!

WhyIstheRumAlwaysGone said...

@bellamarie - thank you so much for accepting! I'll let you know no this thread when it's posted, which should be very soon.

WhyIstheRumAlwaysGone said...

@bellamarie - your comment has now been posted on the blog. Thank you again for sharing...

jessegirl said...

BellaMarie...I'm so sorry about your fiancee. My loss is more recent.
Your words are so important but I can't live up to them yet. I can only try.

Anonymous said...

dear bellamarie, and dear jessegirl. i am so sorry about your lost. you both are right, in the script diana has a completly other personality. there she is a mother who lost her son and she must watch how her other children are suffering. but she cant help. the grief is so deep. the hole in her chest is so big, she cant barely stand it. she is so woundet, she cant move or look forward, she can only try to stand the day. and it is a strong work for her to pretend a normal family, to pretend the whole day -i feel good- is a very hart work and cost a lot of energy. i love the script and i love the movie and both make me cry. at the end, when you can see her smile, i am thinking of the script and than i try to believe that there is probably hope, because in the script i love her. i am sorry to send per anonymous, but i have no account. i am magdalena.

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